Considering starting a WW2 campaign

[Concord]

Hiya guys. I'm considering starting a new WW2 campaign on the forum using a CM title to resolve the battles.
I'm just seeing if there would be players who would be interested in this and would be happy to commit to a long campaign.
Early days yet, but just planting the seed. If I commit, it will be with gusto.

There are 3 main questions which need to be considered.

Which theatre/game?
I'd prefer one of the 'newer' titles like CMRT, CMFB and CMFI/GL.
It could be set on the Eastern front, Western front, or Italy.
From memory there might be a new game/engine/fixes on the horizon soon from Battlefront? Can someone shed light on this?

How to make it streamlined
I think the reason several of our tFGM campaigns have stalled is the time required by the GM's and even each sides' leaders.

I think there are 3 main factors that can be work intensive:

1.) Bean counting
There are ways around this, and I think the easiest way to overcome it is to use the headcount percentages within CM (50-100%) or the system Nathangun used in his Bulge campaign.
In particular, the idea Nathangun had of specifying purchase points for each side and specifying certain purchase limitations was perfect.
It allows each player to cater the force somewhat to his own wishes, and avoids work setting up scenarios by the GM. Here's the map - buy and go.

2.) Strategic moves
Does anyone know of a simple hex based movement program?
I could use Photoshop to create jpeg visuals for strategic map updates, but I'm wondering if there's a smart way to make this easier for GM's and players.
Another significant thing to consider is fog of war. Great to have it, but an extra layer of complexity.

3.) Map making
This is the big one.
There are the stock maps of course, and maybe ones to be downloaded.
Maps could be modified (which Nathangun often did). A big job to create one from scratch. Could ask for volunteers to help perhaps? Anyone interested in this aspect?
If there are certain titles with lots of downloadable maps available, this could influence which game is used. Anyone have insight as to map availability for different CM games?

Format/scale
If the above issues can be streamlined (particularly issue 3!) I see no problem with making it a fairly large campaign, with say 20 - 50 units per side.
A medium to large map would allow some maneuvering.
One option: each unit on the strategic map could be a battalion headcount, with one company plus support entering CM battle (per battalion sized unit taking part).
I don't want to make the campaign technically historical (too much work), so semi or non. I may need some advice from grogs about typical force mixes and such.
Could be attacker/defender, but we could make it equal numbers moving on the strategy map.

 

[Rico]

Cool -- can throw some pointers you way about ideas and pitfalls of running CM campaigns.

Will post a few replies later today when work settles down a bit.

 

[mcmortison]

I would be interrested.

 

[Bulletpoint]

@Rico is of course the guy to go to for advice on this, but here's just a couple of ideas I came up with, take them or leave them:

Make a general rule that all units must be purchased as regulars +0 +0. Apart from elite units that have to be all veterans +0 +0. This should give special units a tangible edge in quality without being overpowered.

Any unit on the main map that cannot trace a direct line to a road and through that road to the friendly side of the map is considered cut off from supplies and has to be purchased with a -1 motivation factor.

 

[rocketman]

I'm interested. A set of master maps (to cut up) to combine for the campaign would be cool. I wonder how the ones from FB could be linked together. Another way is to use existing scenarios and strip away everything but the map.
I have recently toyed with the idea of creating a master map of the Monte Cassino - Cassino Town - Rapido River - San Pasquale area just because it would be sweet looking and dramatic. Also because the next FI module will contain units that fought in the area. I haven't played the Polish campaign from GL (will after the patch) and maybe maps from it can be used also.

 

[Bulletpoint]

Did anyone ever try to run a 1:1 scale campaign (where you control the same size unit on the campaign map and the battle map)? Do the battles get too large?

 

[GDog]

Very interested in playing, while you do all the heavy lifting (joking, kind of)

I think #3 (mapping) will be relatively easy to accomplish. There are some nice big maps over in The Scenario Depot that could be chopped up in the editor. I'm currently messing around with part of the Razymin Master Map. I like using the map editor and would be willing to volunteer some time if you decide to go the custom route.

Redundancy at the GM level is important, so that the campaign can survive the inevitable when real life gets in the way.

CMRT gets my vote for theatre of war!

 

[Rico]

@Concord

Still have this CMRT campaign concept just about waiting and ready to go -- designed it early last year, but got derailed by RL and work somewhere along the way ... ah yes, and FOG II upgrades...LOL

http://www.thefewgoodmen.com/thefgm...attle-for-rikonovo-ii-work-in-progress.27267/

The situation is the following.
Vitebsk is surrounded and the roads are choked with columns of German rear area troops in full retreat towards Borizov and Minsk, crossing the Berzhinka river at the town of Rikonovo.

Red Army mechanised spearheads that have bypassed Vitebsk to the south are believed to be racing towards Rikonovo on both the north and south side of the Berzhinka river.

A Kampfgruppe from 5th Panzer Division is detraining at Borizov and elements are rushed forward to hold the enemy at Rikonovo for as many days as possible to allow for escape of as many retreating troops as possible, to allow for the evacuation of stores and several thousand wounded from Rikonovo ... and to gain time for the main forces of 5th Panzer Division to deploy properly at Borizov and hopefully slow down the Soviet advance north of Minsk.

The situation for both sides is confused -- German CO will try and cobble together a all-round improvised defense with scratch units and panzer troops arriving in dribs and drabs ... the Russian CO trying to push as hard as he can and capture Rikonovo as quickly as possible "off the march" before the German defense can solidify -- with his units battered and possibly strung out due to bad roads and supply problems ... has he outrun his air support and air recon?

Gotta give credit -- pretty map made with "borrowed" graphics from games like Panzer Corps, Unity of Command and a few others ...

Maybe a collaboration project of some kind may be a possibility?

 

[GDog]

Wow @Rico that's pretty. How do you assign CM battle maps to Campaign map sectors?

 

[Concord]

@Rico I wasn't sure if your campaign was still moving forward, and it sounds like it is. I registered my interest in June last year.
I suppose that there isn't as much need for me to develop one necessarily then (although the more the merrier right?).

I've noticed that RL busyness seems to strike players as well. I've seen several drop-outs from campaigns on the forum because people can't get the time to input or even play.
So far only 3 players on this thread have expressed interest. But it might just be a case of "if you build it they will come".

 

[Rico]

@Rico I wasn't sure if your campaign was still moving forward, and it sounds like it is. I registered my interest in June last year.
I suppose that there isn't as much need for me to develop one necessarily then (although the more the merrier right?).

I've noticed that RL busyness seems to strike players as well. I've seen several drop-outs from campaigns on the forum because people can't get the time to input or even play.
So far only 3 players on this thread have expressed interest. But it might just be a case of "if you build it they will come".

It's basically dormant at the moment ... pretty much designed and mostly tested (but I would need to go back and look at my notes) ... I was hesitant to start something with such major time (and long term) commitment -- every time I do that, RL throws in a curve ball -- so been sticking to simpler tourneys like Q&D and the FOG II campaign (which is very light on admin and easy to run)

If the campaign system is flexible, players can slot in and out as life and time permits -- a bit tougher with the CO's as they need deeper knowledge of the rules.

Indeed -- once you have something to show, players will sign up.

 

[Concord]

Very interested in playing, while you do all the heavy lifting (joking, kind of)

I think #3 (mapping) will be relatively easy to accomplish. There are some nice big maps over in The Scenario Depot that could be chopped up in the editor. I'm currently messing around with part of the Razymin Master Map. I like using the map editor and would be willing to volunteer some time if you decide to go the custom route.

Redundancy at the GM level is important, so that the campaign can survive the inevitable when real life gets in the way.

CMRT gets my vote for theatre of war!

Thanks for the leads and the offer to help with maps @GDog.

 

[holoween]

@Rico
So far only 3 players on this thread have expressed interest. But it might just be a case of "if you build it they will come".

Id be interested but i only own CMFB. Most people in a similar position probably wont write that they are interested because there is a reasonable chance they wont be able to play anyways.
For judging general interest a poll would give you better feedback. Especially if you give the options of which game they would be interested in.
Als once its build players will come.

 

[fabishd]

I am interested but only as a CO per @Rico definition. I do not own the games.

 

[Concord]

Hiya @fabishd, good to hear from you buddy. So you don't do any digital combat games? When you were CO in Fredrocker's campaign you never fought any battles?

 

[Panzer_Freak]

I only own CMFB, but might be intrested when all details are cleared.

 

[fabishd]

Hiya @fabishd, good to hear from you buddy. So you don't do any digital combat games? When you were CO in Fredrocker's campaign you never fought any battles?

@Concord that is correct. I am woefully behind in the versions for most of the games which makes keeping up with group difficult. Right now $ are tight for the current future.

 

[Nathangun]

Bean counting

I would go with the option of having a pre built OOB and sticking with it. My mistake in the Bulge was to let team buy reinforcements, this lead to more work for me.
Having a pre built OOB means if a squad or a tanks got eliminated you delete if off the OOB, if a squad suffered casualties, adjust its strength accordingly. Simpler, the trick is to take the game file from the DB very few turns and adjust the OOB as you go along, a lot easier than having to do it all at once.
There's always the OOB AND FORMATION RECORDER.

Strategic moves

I still have the Geccos programme that was used in the CMMC campaigns not sure if you remember that?
I should do a video on how it works, the best programme for real time simulation.
I could help with creating campaign maps, plenty of practice.

Map making

I could help out there.

Anyone have insight as to map availability for different CM games?

I guess the older the game the more maps it has.

Maybe a collaboration project of some kind may be a possibility?

That would be the best way forward, GM's have lives as well.

 

[Concord]

Great advice @Nathangun, thank you!

Great points about the counting of beans. But I was considering simplifying it even more.
If there are say 7 battles per turn, I don't want to be even updating OOB's.
I was thinking in terms of a simplified version of your own system from the Bulge.
I liked the way in your campaign you simply had a purchase point limit, with limitations on purchases (such as infantry only for an infantry battalion, or a maximum purchase on tanks for an armoured unit etc).

Then at the end of the battle, a headcount is done from the post battle report, and from that the unit's strength is done as a percentage - which in turn will affect the maximum points available in the next battle for that unit.
No bean-counting at all, other than working out percentages.

I remember Geccos! It is a possibility. However I am also considering laying a hex grid over an historical map.
It wouldn't be too hard for me to update a Photoshop file to show new positions after movements, especially if each side takes turns moving.
My main concern was how players (particularly the CO's) could easily do the same. I could provide them with the Photoshop file so they could do orders visually I suppose.
Or even just ask them to post text movement orders like Bootie did for his campaign.

 

[Concord]

An addition point. The work of sourcing/modifying/making maps is a big one, but we have had some good suggestions in this thread on downloading, and @GDog and @Nathangun have offered to help with maps.
We could download and chop up a bunch of maps and use good ones as the special points of interest on the strategic map. I could create a strategic map from scratch that caters to what we have.
There would still be a need for 'generic' maps that represent open countryside or woods, but I think we could use existing or modified ones as a storehouse for these hexes.

Once we have battle maps, if we use the simplified purchasing procedure from the post above, all that would be required for setting up a battle file is to draw in set-up zones and specify point limits. Set passwords, and away they go.