After Action reports

[SlySniper]

Ok, finally you can discuss round one.



It appears those Italians were a little tougher than some of you might have thought they would be.



The interesting thing is, The Canadians held the queens on the chess board. Those Sherman’s were like king tigers in this battle. So it might be time to evaluate your play and decide if there was something you should have done differently.



Even though their scores did not reflect wins in general, I believe all 6 Canadian winners did assault the town and in general came close to clearing the objective.



I played Jolly Olly since he came in as a real late added player. I managed to clear the objective and still only had a 52 point advantage because of my losses.

I also noted that if the Canadians are not aggressive, the Italians could seize the initiative and did in at least three battles where the Italians went on the offensive and to a good extent succeeded.



So what was the correct approach or should I say was there one.



Personnally, I feel the only approach is from the left flank for the Canadians, two reasons being that they are out of view from defensive forces except for those that are located on that side of the town. The armor that is coming as reinforcements is entering on that side of the map so it’s easier to get them placed as to helping support the infantry as to approaching and entering the town from that side.

The center would be suicide for advancing infantry.

The right flank, it is possible and a couple of people tried it from that flank. But it’s hard to get your forces on that flank in large numbers, plus even if successful. Entering the town from that flank is very limiting and it has a natural tendency to bottleneck your troops into a poor approach which is easy to defend against.



The funniest thing I like was watching those small rounds bounce of the Sherman’s.

But I did see some aggressive and lucky actions to take some of those precious Sherman’s out of the battle. For those that managed to close assault them with normal Italian infantry and win I applaud you.

Some managed to take them out with their AA assets. In general by immobilizing them of getting the crew to bail.

Anyway, time for you all to tell you terror stories of war and what happened to you.

 

[dkchapuis]

I hope to give a detailed AAR later, but I wanted to share these clips

 

[dkchapuis]

Why the angry face @Artkin?

 

[MeatEtr]

Yeah when those Shermans rolled-in I was like "f*ck me"! But I was already committed to that Obj push with infantry. So was able to hide or pull back most of my light armor. But still kept pushing with troops. Paid off as one of my tank hunters lobbed a satchel onto a Sherman. Then was immediately gunned down.

Almost got the other Sherman but one Canadian with a Bren and quick reaction from the Sherman crew stopped it. Also low morale at this point caused some troops to fallback early. Some great tense moments for sure. Remnants of these troops were able to stay at this Obj to contest it to the end.

Early on repelled the in town recon push and the other from the rear. I didn't lose much to this, only time. Also defended the light push from the left side of town. The flak guns worked well at suppressing/killing any troops in the buildings. At least until the tanks showed up.

I even tried a last min hail Mary to sneak in the back door at the church with one of my light tanks. Didn't work, drove into a piat and an eventual grenade immobilizing it. But was sure fun trying!

Good game @Raskol the Trustworthy here's our AAR and final turn layout!

 

[Artkin]

Why the angry face @Artkin?

Because of the Italians being slaughtered despite being outside the windows ready to kill anyone inside, and then the sherman TK'ing their boys, then the semovente hitting an infantryman moving perpendicular to it, and then immediately sniping a piat team who were laying down in tall grass.
CM is sort of a joke

 

[dkchapuis]

Because of the Italians being slaughtered despite being outside the windows ready to kill anyone inside, and then the sherman TK'ing their boys, then the semovente hitting an infantryman moving perpendicular to it, and then immediately sniping a piat team who were laying down in tall grass.
CM is sort of a joke

ok - yeah all that is on the crazy side

 

[OnePingOnly]

Because of the Italians being slaughtered despite being outside the windows ready to kill anyone inside, and then the sherman TK'ing their boys, then the semovente hitting an infantryman moving perpendicular to it, and then immediately sniping a piat team who were laying down in tall grass.

I wasn't happy with my Italian deaths , but they did take fire from 3 sides - not just from Canucks entering the house in front of them. Chap had surrounded them but I didn't even realize it until it was too late.
As for the Semovente kills, I believe their first shot was a lucky area fire I had set based on a sound contact. Then, after multiple misses by the PIAT team, the Semovente saw and smoked them. The Semovente does seem to have decent spotting, which makes sense at least when opened up.

 

[MeatEtr]

Because of the Italians being slaughtered despite being outside the windows ready to kill anyone inside, and then the sherman TK'ing their boys, then the semovente hitting an infantryman moving perpendicular to it, and then immediately sniping a piat team who were laying down in tall grass.
CM is sort of a joke

I think you should rewatch the video! Italians just outside of the building took fire from behind. So that drew their attention away from the building. Allowing the unit to take the building with fewer losses from the grenades. This tactic is a double edged sword IMO, it can work sometimes but not always. Especially not if theres a whole squad running into a building. The window watchers can usually handle smaller half squads or teams, but normally fail vs a whole squad.

The light tank drove into good facing to kill the soldier running. It was not perpendicular. I'd be a bit salty if that were my PIAT team, missing three shots like that. Not that crazy that the tank spotted the AT team and put a shell right where they are.

Just saying, not as crazy you imply. Grant it, yeah sure we see some crazy LOS and spotting issues nearly every game. Sh!t happens... wars hell... but thats the CM life, its just a game after all!

 

[dkchapuis]

Crazy stuff happens in every CM game. I'm not complaining. I couldnt stop laughing at that first sequence. I wasnt laughing at those damn piats - espcially since I crawled those guys 100s of meters into position and waited for that tank to roll within 125m. They deserved to die if they shoot like that.

I was surprised by how accurate the Semoventes were all game. Certainly Im only remembering the bad stuff, but those guys never seemed to miss. I was expecting their experience level to be higher when the end game map appeared.

 

[Bulletpoint]

espcially since I crawled those guys 100s of meters into position and waited for that tank to roll within 125m. They deserved to die if they shoot like that.

I think PIATs only have an effective range of about 105 metres, so I was not too surprised to see them miss with three shots if the range was 125...

 

[SlySniper]

I agree that I also dont see anything that looks too unexpected. Those Italians just outside of the building , most were laying down and could not see in the building if they wanted too. And since they broke so easy, who is to say thay had not already received fire before that from the back side since there was enemy troops there already.

As for the Piat, agree, its a weapon where you want to be close to avoid just what happened there.

But at times, no question, if you are relying on spotting to win the battle for you, you are playing a risky game, in cm2. You cannot count on your troops spotting as you want. You need the numbers and fire power advantage. so even if things go poorly you can still recover and win the event.

I will take the spotting as is any day over the borg spotting of the past. its not perfect in any way. but way more realistic than the old method.

Just watch 1st person shooters where everyone is actually spotting for themselves and there is no AI envolved. You see all sorts of crazy stuff as to units not seeing enemy units in the heat of battle. Of course screen view is part of that reason. but in real combat it is also very easy to get into what is called tunnel vision.

 

[OnePingOnly]

I agree that I also dont see anything that looks too unexpected. Those Italians just outside of the building , most were laying down and could not see in the building if they wanted too. And since they broke so easy, who is to say thay had not already received fire before that from the back side since there was enemy troops there already.

They were also out of comms with their command unit and in a sub-optimal morale state after the massacre of a fellow squad. I had hoped they would be kneeling to look through the windows, but I simply asked too much of them in a situation where they ended up taking fire from 3 sides.

 

[dkchapuis]

Did anyone kill Italian tanks or crews before the crews made it to the tanks?

I didn’t even try.

Also, did the Italian briefing mention the infiltrators?

 

[Raging Al]

Did anyone manage to KO a Sherman with a Semovente? The few shots I landed (all on the front) caused no damage at all. In fact, the one penetrating shot I landed on the Canadian AC didn’t seem to have any effect either!!!

 

[OnePingOnly]

Also, did the Italian briefing mention the infiltrators?

Yes, it mentioned there were forces already in town. The Semovente crews start off hung-over in a bar and the first challenge is presented as getting them to their vehicles without getting whacked by the infiltrators.

 

[SlySniper]

Someone did not read their briefing or was crazy. ran all their crews right out into the street. They should have been slaughtered.
Except the player he was playing against had set firing archs on his troops in such a way they did not open up on them in that first monute. by the time he changed that for the second minute. he had plenty of troops also in place. so he did lose a few crew members, but in general was very, very lucky.

While I was testing it for play, if you manage to get a team with grenades near them. you could take them out before they are crewed.

But I do not think anyone even tried that in any of the battles I saw.

 

[SlySniper]

Did anyone manage to KO a Sherman with a Semovente? The few shots I landed (all on the front) caused no damage at all. In fact, the one penetrating shot I landed on the Canadian AC didn’t seem to have any effect either!!!

pretty much the only way is to get a shot on the flank or rear.

I felt the best place for them was deep in town so if a Sherman enters the town its easy to get such a shot. like at the crossroads.

but I dont recall seeing many shermans getting killed but there were a few. So maybe. Someone will need to speak up,

 

[KGPanther]

I accidentally deleted my game files on this one (so no pictures), but here is a basic AAR from my (Canadian) perspective:

I decided on a three prong attack, with platoon on my right, one up the center and the rest on the left. First I engaged a squad in the middle of the street with my infiltrators. They killed most of them and a few others in and around the tankettes. They all died not too long after but they did some damage. I agree that the the left was the safer bet- so my main weight was there. I encountered Italians right near me in the vineyard on my left....we engaged in a nasty fire-fight, but was able to push them out and inflict casualties with little of my own. The center outlying buildings was next- platoon sent there dislodged and destroyed most of the Italians there, but I was ambushed by a few straggler Italians and I took casualties I did not expect. In addition, I had identified the location of the 20mm AA gun and thought I had knocked it out with my mortars. As I moved up along the wall with two squads, the damn gun ripped into me right down along the wall, head on, practically whipping out the squads. I was mortified. I love all my pixeltroopen. Got a bead on the 20 mm again and did knock it out. Moved up on the left and cleared up to the edge of the town. In the center I just stayed there with what I had left-only moving them up later in the battle to support attack on town. On the right, I moved up, fought with infantry and engaged the other 20mm and knocked it out. By this time, I had received my armor. One Sherman supported left, one on the right. I used the machine gun tankette and 50 cal carrier as mobile gun platforms going back and forth. Unlucky with Shermans. On my left, vineyard immobilized one Sherman. I was also ambushed and counterattacked on my left, losing way too many troops for little gain into the town. Eventually I wore him down there, allowing me to finally advance. One the right, Sherman successfully engaged tankettes but was close assaulted by two Italian squads. This Sheman was also immobilized by this assault, but with the help of some infantry close by and the machine gun tankett, I was able to kill the squads and not lose the tank outright. I pushed into town after some mop up, I took too many casualties, but did take all objectives.

In hindsight, I was a bit too aggressive with the tanks, getting them immobilized for no good reason. I also didnt take into consideration my units' lower leadership qualities and pushed them too fast to hard. However, with the limited time we had, I felt I did not have the luxery of being cautious and methodical (which I rarely am anyway LOL). All in all, I dont think I would have been relieved of duty, but would have been reprimanded for the amount of casualties I sustained.

 

[SlySniper]

With keeping the battles short and quick. Its hard not to take losses because of having to push quickly.

The question becomes, what is the best methods for taking as few of losses as possible.

Driving the tank in the vines, is almost a gareentee to getting immobilized, avoid them with a passion.

Sounds like the oops was not keeping some fire on the AA unit until you were sure it was out of action.

Those dead troopers from that can come haunt you in your sleep.

 

[SlySniper]

Oh, just so you know, you can recall all your files in dropbox. They are saved, unless you clear that deleted file location also.