Air support and area attacks

[Sendai]

So I'm looking for a bit of help to wrap my head around something. I've been getting back into combat mission and have been messing around in SF2 and recently completed the "British Mech Plt VS Uncon" and am in the middle of "Sabers at dawn". Both of these missions have one thing in common. The British side gets access to a single AH-1 with 20 70mm rockets and 2 Hellfire AT missiles. The help I'm looking for is trying to understand how to direct my air support properly.

In sabers at dawn. I ordered an Area attack on a Syrian position. The AH-1 came in and gave 2 BMP-1s the business with its 2 hellfires. However, that was it. There was no more fire from the AH-1 into the attack area, even though the trenches on the hill had scattered infantry contacts between them and inside. It also failed to attack Syrian infantry in the open on the hillside. I didn't have this issue with a point attack, however. It hosed down the Syrian ATGM team in the open with no issues, the same one it failed to attack after the area attack. Is this due to a spotting error? Do air support assets need to spot/search attack areas and spot infantry, while with point attacks they're receiving direct guidance from the FO, so it isn't an issue for them? Wondering what the veteran player's thoughts or guidance on this is. Maybe I missed something in the manual.

 

[Gnarly]

Honestly I've barely used modern airpower, but I'd definitely think some of your sentiments are correct.

• The bigger the designated search area, the less likely the aircrew will spot targets, particularly infantry.
• They will spot vehicles much easier than infantry
• No idea if its modelled, but I would think enemy vehicle target recognition by aircrew would be far easier than discriminating ground forces as friend vs foe?
• What was the FO communication link like with the ground units who had spotted the infantry? Did the FO 'know' about that infantry? As opposed to say the ATGM teams (different spotting units, better comms through the command structure to the FO?)
• Was the mission munitions loadout the same in both cases (light, medium, heavy)?

 

[Lethaface]

So I'm looking for a bit of help to wrap my head around something. I've been getting back into combat mission and have been messing around in SF2 and recently completed the "British Mech Plt VS Uncon" and am in the middle of "Sabers at dawn". Both of these missions have one thing in common. The British side gets access to a single AH-1 with 20 70mm rockets and 2 Hellfire AT missiles. The help I'm looking for is trying to understand how to direct my air support properly.

In sabers at dawn. I ordered an Area attack on a Syrian position. The AH-1 came in and gave 2 BMP-1s the business with its 2 hellfires. However, that was it. There was no more fire from the AH-1 into the attack area, even though the trenches on the hill had scattered infantry contacts between them and inside. It also failed to attack Syrian infantry in the open on the hillside. I didn't have this issue with a point attack, however. It hosed down the Syrian ATGM team in the open with no issues, the same one it failed to attack after the area attack. Is this due to a spotting error? Do air support assets need to spot/search attack areas and spot infantry, while with point attacks they're receiving direct guidance from the FO, so it isn't an issue for them? Wondering what the veteran player's thoughts or guidance on this is. Maybe I missed something in the manual.

Yeah I think if you want the Helicopters to have a good chance of engaging infantry targets, it helps if he has LOS to the targets (and or tentative contacts). Last time I had an Apache it did actually engage infantry running in the open with the 70mm rockets. It was on a area strike, the FO had LOS on the target area and spotted some of the infantry.

 

[Sendai]

Honestly I've barely used modern airpower, but I'd definitely think some of your sentiments are correct.

• The bigger the designated search area, the less likely the aircrew will spot targets, particularly infantry.
• They will spot vehicles much easier than infantry
• No idea if its modelled, but I would think enemy vehicle target recognition by aircrew would be far easier than discriminating ground forces as friend vs foe?
• What was the FO communication link like with the ground units who had spotted the infantry? Did the FO 'know' about that infantry? As opposed to say the ATGM teams (different spotting units, better comms through the command structure to the FO?)
• Was the mission munitions loadout the same in both cases (light, medium, heavy)?

I'm beginning to believe that it is in fact a spotting issue. in the first case, the FO didn't spot or have any clue the infantry were present in the target area. So it was up to the aircrew to find it. I'm still testing, however.

Honestly I've barely used modern airpower, but I'd definitely think some of your sentiments are correct.

• The bigger the designated search area, the less likely the aircrew will spot targets, particularly infantry.
• They will spot vehicles much easier than infantry
• No idea if its modelled, but I would think enemy vehicle target recognition by aircrew would be far easier than discriminating ground forces as friend vs foe?
• What was the FO communication link like with the ground units who had spotted the infantry? Did the FO 'know' about that infantry? As opposed to say the ATGM teams (different spotting units, better comms through the command structure to the FO?)
• Was the mission munitions loadout the same in both cases (light, medium, heavy)

No, the mission munition loadouts were not the same. The first area attack was a "heavy mission" while the point target was a "Light" mission

 

[Lethaface]

I'm beginning to believe that it is in fact a spotting issue. in the first case, the FO didn't spot or have any clue the infantry were present in the target area. So it was up to the aircrew to find it. I'm still testing, however.

IIRC aircrew have issue finding infantry by themselves, especially if they are inside buildings etc. I think helicopters are more good at it than fixed wing, but getting some clue's from the FO about where to look helps a lot.

 

[Sgt Joch]

yes, probably a spotting issue. Air seems to be better at spotting vehicles. They seem at their best when you give them a large area order, then they will suppress vehicles in the area.

The best way to use them against infantry is like artillery, i.e. a point order on a spot. In that case however, you are better to use artillery for that

 

[fivefivesix]

No, the mission munition loadouts were not the same. The first area attack was a "heavy mission" while the point target was a "Light" mission

I think this difference is the key variable and reason you’re seeing two different results. If given a “heavy” mission order, I don’t think air support AI will override that to engage infantry, even if light weapons are available.