Yeah, but Bazookas are cheaper than Schrecks (34 vs 52 pts in CMFI) and get the job done against typical armor. I'm also quite sure Bazookas are more commonly coming with infantry formations "for free" or floating around for grabs in vehicles.
No, because then he has his Fireflies. The point is that cheap Shermans + Fireflies is both better value and able to take on anything the Germans can field.
Of course, Allied victory is not secured - it depends on player skill and luck, too. I just think the dice are heavily loaded in Allied favour.
Rarity is not the main limiting factor in the most important cases, more the exotic stuffs, Stuggs are the main victim..decreasing rarity wont affect them
Not free, when purchasing your infantry you can pay extra for a squad to have a Bazooka..kinda like "would you like fries with that "
Just sharing my experience. Turret hit = penetration practically guaranteed. Upper hull hit = anything between ricochet and partial penetration at medium to long ranges. Even partial pen can kill it, of course.
There were some numbers posted on the BFC forums a while back suggesting there is little difference in win rates between German and Allied in QBs.
We'll just have to agree to disagree. IMO cheap Shermans are never a smart buy in unrestricted QBs. But it's a good thing we do not all think the same or QBs would get real boring.
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A great example of where the points reflect value. Shrecks have a longer range and are more accurate overall. They should cost more.
Each of the Infantry AT weapons has its own pros and cons.
Panzershreck Pros: Longest range, biggest warhead, virtually guaranteed to kill any allied tank it hits. Cons: Massive muzzle blast leading to every enemy in the postcode knowing your location.
Bazooka Pros: Decent range, far lower muzzle blast. Cons: Smallest warhead, spaced armour often defeats it.
PIAT Pros: Second biggest warhead, no muzzle blast = very sneaky, tanks & players may not even realise they are under attack. Cons: Shortest range, accuracy poor at maximum range, spaced armour may defeat it.
Panzershreck Pros: Longest range, biggest warhead, virtually guaranteed to kill any allied tank it hits. Cons: Massive muzzle blast leading to every enemy in the postcode knowing your location.
Bazooka Pros: Decent range, far lower muzzle blast. Cons: Smallest warhead, spaced armour often defeats it.
PIAT Pros: Second biggest warhead, no muzzle blast = very sneaky, tanks & players may not even realise they are under attack. Cons: Shortest range, accuracy poor at maximum range, spaced armour may defeat it.
Yes, agreed. Thanks for sharing your point of view.
Not to argue any further, but just to follow up on your point about rarity. It's true that in CMFB, the cheapest Sherman (199 points) is labelled as "Rare", but my point was more about CMBN.
I came back from work and took a moment to look at the Shermans labelled as "Standard" - which means zero rarity:
CMFB
M3A4(75)W
217 points
CMBN
Sherman I
Sherman II
Sherman V
All 176-177 points.
My recollection is that the UK never got uparmored Shermans, so if cheap Sherman hordes are your jam the Brits have you covered (but you'll have to wait for the next module in CMFB).
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I use British 75mm Shermans all the time.
They are awesome. You will rarely find a better infantry killer. They also carry smoke shells that are incredibly helpful. Being cheap means that you can buy more of them and get better angles on your opponent.
CM is about breaking down your enemy's combined arms attack / defense in a logical way. You use the right tool for the job as part of a well thought out concept. Your 75mm Sherman should not be shooting it out frontally with an enemy Panther. It has a dozen other great uses.
These data conversations are interesting and understanding the data is very necessary. You have to know what will work in a given situation.
But on another level, you don't even want to roll the dice in a frontal armor vs frontal armor shoot-out between comparable tanks. You want to seek flank shots. Or at least engagements where you fire the first shot.
If you are a player that just puts a PzIV vs a Sherman and just rolls the dice......you will win about 50% of the time and lose 50% of the time.
But you can do better than that.
I think we all understand and agree on this. But tactics are a differet discussion...
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That was me thinking Axis was disadvantaged. I was disabused of this but am still not fully convinced. Wonderful discussion all!
Bump. Do we want to follow through with the petition on this (see other thread)?