QOTD #8 - Impact of upgunning the M4 Sherman to 76mm?
- Thread starter Bootie
- Start date
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ChuckDyke
Guest
The Chieftain is one of those people worth listening too. I did some research about the 75 mm gun. A Sherman can knock itself out over the distance of a typical CM Map. It is only common sense to take note of the terrain. Engage enemy armour at 500 meters or less. The Chieftain's words, not mine.
You know, in looking at the height of the American AFV's in ChuckyDykes one photo with all the armor lined up, the thing that stands out to me is better hull down potential because as a rule US AFV's have had good gun depression. A little bit taller, maybe better hull down on a steeper slope.
Correction: ChuckDyke, not ChuckyDyke. No offense meant sir!
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ChuckDyke
Guest
The Centurion was used for letter dropping. Read fire a 20 pounder HE shell through the slit of a pillbox. The museum in Seoul was worthy of a visit. Because I am over 65 the museums in Korea don't charge an entrance fee. Just show an ID like your driver's license.
Wow, cool.
I've wondered if this could be replicated in CM somewhat, you buy five Panthers but only three show up because the other two broke down trying to get to the battlefield - I can imagine it wouldn't be a popular change!
I actually have thought that mechanism in one of my campaign designs
-- before the reinforcing Panther(or Tiger) company arrives on the map a "breakdown die roll" is made to see how many actually arrive on the battlefield.
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ChuckDyke
Guest
It explains a Pz IV missing in the Peiper Campaign. We got off easy thenI actually have thought that mechanism in one of my campaign designs
"Letter dropping."
Had not heard that expression before.
Had not heard that expression before.
I actually have thought that mechanism in one of my campaign designs
I imagine there will be some bad words when someone rolls snake eyes.
Them's the break(downs)I imagine there will be some bad words when someone rolls snake eyes.
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ChuckDyke
Guest
Better, Tank vs Tank better than the T34/85 too. The 76 mm Sherman had the same 76 mm as the Hellcat. However, the Hellcat had HVAP shell in its racks. In Korea, the Sherman was the superior, also better-trained crew.
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ChuckDyke
Guest
Look at your average map in CM and first shot hit probability you need a range of five hundred meters or less. Like the Chieftain pointed out all those guys complaining all survived the war. He quoted the casualties of US tankers around 1500. I agree 1500 too many/
Versus 4 ID's 700% casualty rate?
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ChuckDyke
Guest
I don't know what you mean. Total loss of life for the military in Western Europe was 276000 (estimated). The Chieftain quoted 1500 for the armoured forces. I don't think they had the infrastructure in place to manufacture a different type of tank in quantity. Only in Korea, they had the weapons they should have had during WW2
Yes, but I believe that Cheiftain was contrasting the armor casualties versus the infantry's and army air corps to show that armor casualties in total and as a percentage was significantly lower than the other two arms. He did reference that the 4th ID suffered a 700% casualty rate I believe, That's KIA, MIA, WIA. I took his point to be that armor service was not the "death trap" that is often portrayed.
incidentally, in one of the Chieftain's excellent vids, he compared the casualty figures between British and US Sherman crews and found that the Brits had higher casualties - which he took to be because they only wore berets, whereas the Yanks had their helmets to protect them. But still, being a tank crewman was much preferable to being a foot soldier.
I think also that Chieftain has mentioned that the 17 pounder Shermans were a tight fit in the turret. Could that have impeded escape in the event of a hit?
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ChuckDyke
Guest
At least for the loader, that man worked in extremely cramped conditions.
Quite a few WW2 tanks seem pretty difficult to get out of when I have looked at them: I remember going to a military display a few years back and there was a Cromwell - the driver and front mg operator's exit doors (at the side) were quite small. Possibly people were a bit smaller due to poorer nutrition but I think my skinny teenage self would have had trouble getting through them. Let alone if you were injured.