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The killing of Jochen Peiper

Personally I think this Rommel guy is just trolling. That is the risk when suddenly new members turn up. Personally I was asked to join this site by Earl. I know him for years.

Remove that idiot who calls himself Rommel from this forum. It is a troll.
 
sorry, I was speaking for all who have died by murderous hands. It was my uncles who fought in ww2, it was my friends dad who was in the forth armor, another who was in the 3rd armor, another who was in the army air force. and the thousands of vets I see every month. my baby bro was in Iraq and 3 cousins there now. I hope they save the u.s. from our enemy. and if they have the chance come home. The topic was touchy to begin with and some people can not accept the truth. peiper was executed an a gift to the USA. it was 1976.

nice death head on your cap
 
Well, perhaps we can go back on topic again. I've read some time ago that the burned body of Peiper was mutilated and that his hands and feet were severed from his body. Is this story true and if so, is there any evidence (reports or something) to be found on the net?

I DON'T want to hear whether he deserved it or not, I'm just looking for some facts. Everybody can make their own judgement as far as I'm concerned, but let's not abuse this thread for that.
 
I have read the same thing. I can't say whether its true. One particular book I read on him didn't mention anything about Peiper missing his hands and feet. I also read that the public will never know all the details of the investigation because it has been sealed and the public is not allowed to view it. I'm sure that report would be the best source to finding out whether his hands and feet were missing. I might do some more research of the investigation report and see whether parts of it if not all of is has been leaked.

I couldn't imagine cutting off someone's hands and feet. But, that's just me.
 
I would be very interested in the details if you find any, Unique. Thanks.
 
There's a 6-page long discussion about Peiper here, including pics of a shrivelled corpse-

http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?f=38&t=86720

Two pics of Peiper in 1957 aged 42, and a third (right) at later date-
TwoPeipPics1957plusThird.jpg






Peipers charred remains before being shipped to Germany for burial in the Peiper family plot.
The fire-shrivelled nature of the corpse may have given rise to rumours that bits were cut off-
peip-remains.jpg


"O mighty Caesar! dost thou lie so low?
Are all thy conquests, glories, triumphs, spoils,
Shrunk to this little measure?"
-Shakesp, J. Caesar
 
I quite like this quote.

"My men are the products of total war, grown up in streets of scattered towns without any education. The only thing they knew was to handle weapons for the Reich. They were young people with a hot heart and the desire to win or die according to the word: right or wrong - my country. When seeing today the defendants in the dock, don't believe them to be the old Kampfgruppe Peiper. All of my old friends and comrades have gone before. The real outfit is waiting for me in Valhalla."
-Joachim "Jochen" Peiper , 1946
Click to expand...
 
Yes, that also impressed me. These men lived in a world we can never fully understand.
 
Here is a particular quote by Peiper that I like.
"History is always written by the victor, and the histories of the losing parties belong to the shrinking circle of those who were there." Joachim Peiper

Here's another quote, however, Willis Everett is quoting Tom Paine during the closing arguments of the Malmedy trial.
"He that would make his own liberty secure must guard even his enemy from oppression, for if he violates this duty, he establishes a precedent which will reach himself."
 
Yes, that also impressed me. These men lived in a world we can never fully understand.
Click to expand...

yes that is true but in case of Peiper he was on evil side and he fully supported Nazis ! - there were a lot of really heroes of that time and you are talking about Peiper he was IMHO Pathetic
 
Looks like I missed much of a lively discussion here while I was away :)

I agree pretty much with MGK, Peiper was not a pleasant individual and pretty much the poster boy for the Nazi soldier... although ironically he probably had nothing to do with the Malmedy massacre itself as he wasn't on the scene, but the event was probably symptomatic of the institutionalised brutality of the Waffen SS, especially on the Eastern Front . But again, things aren't necessarily as black and white -- W-SS units probably contained many soldiers that were just that, elite soldiers, but also a large number of them were very politicised and indoctrinated. The rank and file of the W-SS that late in the war no longer consisted of enthusiastic volunteers, but mainly of recruits combed out of other services and hastily trained and incorporated into their ranks.

The question of Peiper's murder is two-fold.... we can say from a moral pov that he got what he deserved -- but then living in constitutional democracies which have the rule and respect for law as their foundation, one cannot condone extra-judicial murder or vigilatiism.
Peiper was tried for Malmedy -- the Soviets had the option to try him for war crimes in Russia, but didn't (the Soviet army's war crimes especially in Eastern Europe are for another discussion).

The Cold War kind of put a stop to a lot of hunting & persecution of Nazis in the west and plenty of them were needed in the service of countering the communist threat both militarily and by rebuilding the West German economy as a bulwark.
 
mgk said:
yes that is true but in case of Peiper he was on evil side and he fully supported Nazis ! - there were a lot of really heroes of that time and you are talking about Peiper he was IMHO Pathetic
Click to expand...

And you are entitled to that opinion. I don't agree about him being pathetic, but as long as it doesn't smother an open discussion about his military career and afterwards I don't mind. What annoys me is that as soon as the name Peiper is mentioned some people can't use normal language anymore and start accusing other people of being fascist or neo-nazi. Whether you like it or not Peiper was a hero. A hero for the dark, evil side, yes, but a hero. And heroes always have had blood on their hands, from Richard the Lionheart to Frederic the Great and from Alexander to Jean de la Valette. It is no justification for what they did or didn't do. And it doesn't say anything about the ideals they fought for or the world they tried to create. It just makes them fascinating to study.
 
Hello, I'm new

PoorOldSpike said:
Germans tend to do what their commanders tell them without thinking for themselves.
Brit POW Airey Neave says when he was captured in WW2 he asked a German officer why they hated Jews, and the officer replied "Because the Fuhrer tells us to".
Even today, it's almost impossible to find a German wargamer who'll discuss WW2 because the German Government doesn't want them to talk about it.
For example I asked a German guy in the Wargames Player Club and a German guy in FGM to tell me what Germans think about war films such as The Longest Day, Bridge at Remagen, Enemy at the Gates, Saving Private Ryan etc, but they both refused to discuss them, the WPC guy said "we're not allowed to talk about the Third Reich in the forum", and the FGM guy wriggled out of it by saying something like "Er...I don't think I've seen any of those films"..
Click to expand...
I just signed on to try to contribute. I like forums about ww2. I was looking in to another site about the attempt to kill Hitler. During the filming of the movie about that "operation valkarie" the subject of holocaust denial came up.
I notice they also have laws about Holocaust denial in countries like Austria, Germany, Belgium and others...there is some attempt to make this apply to internet activity as well. That may have something to do with the reluctance of them talking about it.
I know in America I always think I can say anything I want, as long as I am respectful, but it may not be the case elsewhere. Or at least the consequences maybe potentially different.
Gestafalus
 
Yeah, in Germany it´s very crazy. It´s custom and practice from the turks, arabs (most the younger generation) and such people to start hassle. And if it´s not going as they thought - because the germans fight back - they have just to call "Nazi, Nazi!!!" and You are already in trouble with the law. And furthermore it´s common for the law to concede the majority. So if You fight against 2 or 3 of that scum and if the police arrives all three say You started the fight and said national socialist´s things. And because they are three and You only one the police have to arrest You or to take You to court.
Before a week or two I had a dispute with three turks because I said they should keep quiet. The reason was they honked like mad on the street. They were to lazy to cross the little street (all in all 10 metres distance) to ring the bell. After my speech (I had to holler because it was so loud) they made a risky U-turn with their BMW and scratched to a halt short before me. And then they started insulting. After a short time I got really angry and said "**** off You ****ing turk!". They were shocked because a german said such things in public and before witnesses. OK, I asked furthermore if he had need of a pounding. I was in rage. To my luck a woman and their mother gave me rear cover so the turks saw they had no chance to win in case it come to court.
The only thing I regret is that I said "...****ing turk!". For concerned bystanders it have to seem I hate foreigners. But that isn´t the case - and I have to be thankful for two or three times as turks and arabs safed my life - surprise surprise - against turks and arabs. But these are the minority in Germany.

Greetings
 
Can one go and see his burnt down house? Or have they removed it all like they did with the fuehrers bunker?
You also say that they had to cancel the village fete... where they really planning on a celebration in the village after this terrible crime was comitted?
 
Hey, I wonder how many people have visited the site of the burnt house and picked up old bricks and bits of debris as souvenirs since I pinpointed its position in this thread, ha ha..
Even if it was bulldozed over with earth, I'm sure a bit of digging would find stuff that might have escaped the flames and be worth a fortune to militaria collectors, eg- Peiper's toothbrush etc..;)
 
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